Informal Newspaper Polls: Kobe Will Win MVP
NBA April 10th. 2008, 12:24pm
Chalk up one strong argument for Kobe as MVP. But apparently, everyone can stop lobbying for the NBA’s second-leading scorer – according to two informal newspaper polls, Kobe will defeat Chris Paul to capture the award. The LA Times and the Cleveland Plain Dealer decided to poll voters and find out who they were casting a ballot for. Both papers had Kobe winning. (UPDATE: It’s because he can jump over moving cars!)
Here’s what we don’t get: Kobe is universally referred to as the best player in the league. How? Why? We realize this is a subjective argument and there is no right answer, but we have a sneaking suspicion that this is because Kobe’s in his late 20’s and it’s time to anoint him as such. No need to get bogged down with individual stats, but how about the mere fact that in the last three seasons, Kobe has not gotten the Lakers out of the first round of the playoffs? And its not like he lost to a team (Suns both times) that went to the Finals. (Spare us the “supporting cast” argument: One player took down the Pistons last year, and it should be noted that the Pistons had, statistically, the 2nd best defense in the NBA.) Sorry, but for our money, LeBron James is bigger, faster, and stronger, and he possess a slightly better skill set at both ends of the floor than Kobe does.
And not that it matters, but this is coming from a longtime Lakers fan (1985ish, when we went to our first game … to the day Shaq was traded).
Photo: Icon Sports Media
103 Responses to “Informal Newspaper Polls: Kobe Will Win MVP”
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April 10th, 2008 at 12:26 PM
Whitlock is filling in for Rome today; he’s talking to Barkley right now–Barkley is talking up Chris Paul…
Barkley and Whitlock are hilarious!
April 10th, 2008 at 12:27 PM
Oh, brother.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:29 PM
This may be a bit off topic, but does anyone have stats about Kobe’s shooting percentage and its correlation to whether the Lakers win or not? It seems as though when he has his 11-for-26 nights (like Tuesday against Portland) L.A. loses, but when he shoots well (9-for-15 against Sacramento on Sunday), they win.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:30 PM
And didn’t Kobe average 35 a few years ago and lead LA to the playoffs with Smush Parker, Chris Mihm and Kwame Brown in the stacked West?
How is that different than what LeBron is doing this year?
April 10th, 2008 at 12:30 PM
TBL- explain to me how Lebron is better than Kobe defensively ?
April 10th, 2008 at 12:31 PM
Captain Obvious Pants, i’m sure you might be on to something here.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:31 PM
Whitlock was ragging on Barkley for not lobbying hard enough for Kobe to win it; he told Charles that he and Kenny and the TNT crew were the most influential voices in the game, and if THEY said Kobe should get it, he would. Good times…
April 10th, 2008 at 12:35 PM
Kobe is a 7 time ALL DEFENSE SELECTION
LEBRON HAS NONE
so how does Lebron have a better skill set on the defensive end?
April 10th, 2008 at 12:37 PM
Is no one working today? This thing would have 50 comments by now on a normal day.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:37 PM
@benji
Yeah, it might be obvious, but it seems as though Kobe has to shoot well for them to win, as opposed to someone like Chris Paul that has other ways to ensure his team’s success.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:38 PM
irish…andy roddick has better techinical skill set than federerererer, but who has more wins? skills dont always translate into effectiveness.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Diesel…it normally would, but the topic has been beaten to death too many times for anyone to really give a shit.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:41 PM
TBL- explain to me how Lebron is better than Kobe defensively ?
On stats alone, they are equals in steals, and LeBron blocks more shots. Be logical – in the clutch, who would you rather have defending the opposing team’s best player – a 6-8, 240 guy, or a 6-6 220 guy? Good luck posting up LeBron.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:41 PM
OMG QUIT HATIN’ ON (FAVORITE TEAM/PLAYER X)!!1!
I’M SUPER DUPER SERIAL!
April 10th, 2008 at 12:43 PM
The Big Lead, you did not just use blocks and steals to tell me LeBron is a better defender.. no you Didnnnnt!!
April 10th, 2008 at 12:44 PM
be logical? I am
i would take Larry Hughes defense over Lebrons, please
posting up Lebron, fucking Rashard Lewis scrawny ass did it to him every game we played them
April 10th, 2008 at 12:44 PM
TBL just asking are you one of those guys that still blame Kobe for Shaq being traded?
April 10th, 2008 at 12:44 PM
TBL loves baiting. He scolds us for talking LeBron/Kobe, then starts an entire topic about the MVP in which LeBron isn’t even going to be in the equation this year, yet highlights LeBron.. Hmmm. Why did I take the bait..
April 10th, 2008 at 12:44 PM
oh for fuck’s sake…
April 10th, 2008 at 12:45 PM
The Cavaliers were infinitely better defensively when Larry Hughes was there guarding the other team’s best player… (I won’t bring up offense)
April 10th, 2008 at 12:46 PM
TBL, LeBron stopped playing defense halfway through the season.. (IMO) He was showing that he made strides, but regressed right back to where he was last year.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:46 PM
TBL why are you bringing up what happened in past year’s when talking about who should be MVP for 2008? That makes no sense at all.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:47 PM
TBL: So you stopped being a fan of the Lakers after Shaq was traded? Hmmm….I wonder if there is any bias or resentment towards Kobe based on that fact? The Answer is….Yes.
Although, I’m not sure that it matters because, as you said, it’s a subjective argument. No right answer. For my money, I would take Kobe as MVP. As many commenters have pointed out, he is better defensively than Lebron and is his equal offensively in my book. Plus, his all consuming desire to win is appealing to this Portland fan. Lebron may have a similar desire, but I have not seen it manifest itself in the same manner. Plus, he’s so concerned with being a marketing giant it seems his focus is divided.
Just my opinion.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:48 PM
why are we talking about LBJ? he isnt winning the MVP.
lets talk about why CP3 should win over Kobe…please.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:48 PM
You guys know who i think is MVP, and i think it is absolute bullshit that Lebrons name gets mentioned. Where is the MVP talk for TIm Duncan if you want to throw out names. Yeah he lost last night, but look at the stats. He is putting up his best year by far, but no talk.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:48 PM
Oh ok, I read it wrong, you went from talking about MVP to then about who is the better player.
But then I must ask after you told commenters to stop talking about this on the Ballin post, why do you make a post of it?
April 10th, 2008 at 12:49 PM
TBL, it’s just lazy to pick on Kobe for the Lakers’ first round woes when you know damn well LeBron would have not gotten past the first round either..
April 10th, 2008 at 12:52 PM
Yeah, in all this Kobe/LeBron talk we’re ignoring the fact that Chris Paul has pulled a Western Conference contender out of his own ass.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:55 PM
Ewwwwwwww
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30127123&id=1419810129
April 10th, 2008 at 12:56 PM
Also, Kobe can leap over moving cars.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:56 PM
how did Kobe win in the Cleveland Plain Dealer? Spencer, don’t your people know anything about being a homer?
April 10th, 2008 at 12:57 PM
It wasn’t one man who took down the Pistons last year. It was one man and a group of poor officials.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:57 PM
Kobe is the master of the facial.
April 10th, 2008 at 12:58 PM
To anyone that lives in the NOVA/DC area, it is so nice outside right now it should be illegal to have to work today. I love this weather so much I want to take it out behind the middle school and gets it pregnant.
/so excited about 30 Rock tonight that I am copying quotes
April 10th, 2008 at 12:59 PM
oh come on, SOUR GRAPES.
more like a bunch of pussies who didn’t wanna get run over. tayshaun…im looking at you.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:01 PM
Part of the reason, yes. Regardless of what has been said in the media, I think it’s impossible not to think Kobe was part of the reason.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:02 PM
benji…na, they know LBJ is gone so they dont wanna get everyone’s hopes up with an MVP.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:02 PM
412, +100
Kobe has nothing on Joey Gaethwright.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:03 PM
I got an idea of how to fix the MVP award. MAKE IT FOR THE ENTIRE SEASON PLAYOFFS INCLUDED.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:03 PM
No anti-Kobe bias. Still enjoy his work.
Just think Paul’s the MVP this season.
As for why this post – there’s news: the papers have Kobe winning MVP based on polls. This isn’t a get-worked-up-get-pissed-off post.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:04 PM
Jesus..I thought this was a Ballin topic…I miss a few days and Kobe v Lebron gets it’s own post…anyway CP3 is better than them both
April 10th, 2008 at 1:06 PM
Late to the party.
RE: Kobe vs. Lebron on defense. I think it’s pretty even and they’re both a little overrated.
I remember the first year Kobe was on the all-Defense team which was due to a game late in the season vs. Philly when he clamped down on AI and Doug Collins was raving about him being one of the best defensive players in the game.
Well, that same year Kobe got matched up vs. Portland in the playoffs and Portland attacked and absolutely KILLED Kobe by putting Bonzi and Isaiah Rider in the post against him. It forced the Lakers to double team. You shouldn’t need a double team if you’re 1st team all-defense.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:07 PM
Agreed everyone is getting off target and going Kobe/LBJ. TBL was just using Lebron as a point of reference because he took his rag tag nobody’s to the finals. The real point we are all missing is CP3 is the real MVP
April 10th, 2008 at 1:07 PM
Forget about Lebron for a second, since he’s obviously Kobe’s superior.
Can someone prove Kobe has been better than Dirk Nowitzki over the last 3-4 years?
And just to cut you off at the pass, no mention of “will to win” or “guile” will be allowed as evidence.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:08 PM
Dwight Howard for MVP
Hedo for MIP
Hedgehog for Coach of the year
JJ redick, bitch of the year
end of story
April 10th, 2008 at 1:08 PM
Steals is pretty poor category to measure defensive ability. Number two in the league is Baron Davis and I don’t think anyone’s mistaking him for Gary Payton.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:09 PM
NSR, not true.. Nobody in the NBA can really guard one-on-one all the time. Also, it’s the coaches who vote on this award (which is why I put some stock into the result)..they coaches have little to no motivation to be swayed by hype.
CP3 has absolutely had an incredible year, but Kobe’s dealt with far more injuries and the Lakers are right there. That’s the deciding factor to me. Wouldn’t at all be upset either way with the outcome
April 10th, 2008 at 1:10 PM
@cursed: Which is why Derek Jeter is a perennial Gold Glover? But baseball coaches are so different from basketball, because basketball coaches give a rat’s ass about meaningless awards? Gotcha.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:10 PM
Nick, can you prove Dirk’s been superior to Kobe? If so how? And none of this “Kobe’s overrated bunk” as your main argument.. or “getting out of the first round” which we know Dirk would not have done given Kobe’s teammates.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:12 PM
Baseball managers aren’t studying game film on fielding the way NBA coaches are… Baseball managers aren’t saying “Hit the ball to the short stop, he’s terrible”.. instead, managers are saying “just make contact with the ball”
Terrible comparison
April 10th, 2008 at 1:13 PM
Again, it all hinges on the ability to take (AND MAKE) shots. Dirk is a much more efficient scorer. He’s also a far superior rebounder and not such a turnover waiting to happen, like Kobe.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:15 PM
I tend to lean toward Chris Paul. That team would just fall apart without him.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:15 PM
Mike Brown: “Lebron, it looks like Shane Battier is on you tonight. He’s the best perimeter defender in the league. Since I’m an NBA coach that knows everything, I think we’re running the offense through Wally tonight!”
April 10th, 2008 at 1:16 PM
I hate how Kobe gets talked about for superior defense. Its one thing to be able to guard your posistion. Its another to be able to guard 4 posistions.
/Bitter Shawn Marion never even made Second team all defense
April 10th, 2008 at 1:16 PM
I just hate that there is going to be this excuse that LEbron has a poor back when they get swept in the first round. No people, realize you have a shitty team with one great player.
like i said before, you need help to win titles. Lebron has no help
April 10th, 2008 at 1:17 PM
the lakers have the best roster, 1-12, in the entire league. the only way to interpret an MVP award in my book is to replace the candidates with an “average” player at the same position.
hornets with mike bibby? most likely hanging with portland around the 40 win mark.
lakers with jason richardson? definitely still in the playoffs.
and also, is david west an all-star if he’s on chicago or houston? hell no.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:17 PM
Tough for Dirk to turn the ball over considering he just comes off screens and shoots.. Kobe is a main ball handler for the Lakers, and he’s also far more aggressive. I notice you didn’t mention Dirk’s defensive ability (half the game).. is that because it would have weakened your argument? I wouldn’t hope the 7 foot Dirk would be a better rebounder than Kobe.. who’s a decent rebounder for a 6′6 guy don’t you think?
Much more efficient shooter? He makes 2 more shots out of 100 in a game… big freaking deal. That’s not the chasm you think it is.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:18 PM
YSSA, the Laker roster doesn’t look so impressive when it’s Kobe starting along side Sash V, Vlad, Turiaf and D-Fish.. which has been their lineup recently..
April 10th, 2008 at 1:19 PM
@rumeal robinson- its like Orlando having Samuel Dalembert at center. barely above water in florida if that would be the case
great nickname by the way
April 10th, 2008 at 1:20 PM
Its funny your brought that up cause Jason Whitlock was trying to argue with Barkley that CP3 just racks up totals because he is the main ball handler and Kobe isn’t on the lakers.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:22 PM
YYSA, but Kobe isn’t running pick and role on the Lakers, nor is he driving and kicking. There’s a reason Phil Jackson hasn’t had a +7 assist guy in his offense in the last 10 years.. the Triangle doesn’t thrive that, everyone touches the ball in his offense, which diminishes individual stat mongering.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:22 PM
The fact that it’s easier to rebound for a 7-footer doesn’t make the act any less valuable.
Kobe’s cork screw fadeaways are still only worth 2 points.
No degree of difficulty in the NBA.
Earl Boykins is a decent rebound for a 5′5″ guy. Guess what, he’s still a horrible rebounder in the grand scheme of things.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:22 PM
/81
April 10th, 2008 at 1:22 PM
vujacic is playing extremely well lately. he’s a carl landry type for the stretch run. radman is very highly compensated and a lot of teams would enjoy him as a 6th man, let alone 8th or 9th. and fischer was starting in the conference finals last year!! that lineup is still way above average.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:23 PM
And I’d love to see one Maverick fan chime in here with a “Hey, we’re happier with Dirk than we’d be with Kobe.” .. I’m just looking for one. That’s the worst argument you’ve ever made on here Nick.. that and when you used the term “travesty” to describe Kobe potentially winning this year’s MVP
April 10th, 2008 at 1:24 PM
D-Fish is getting abused defensively..as does Vlad Rad (heck, the whole Laker team is.. why isn’t that considered in “best roster of all time” arguments?)..
To be where the Lakers are with all those injuries is ridiculous.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:24 PM
Who do Whitlock and Barkley have winning it?
Just curious – when was the last time a PG averaged 20 points and 10 assists? Paul is also leading the NBA in assists and steals, so the point could be made that he’s having the greatest season for an NBA point guard since …. (and yes, those 3 combined vaunt Paul’s season ahead of what Nash did the last 2 years)
April 10th, 2008 at 1:28 PM
and to whoever said the MVP should be given after the finals, that would be pointless. The winner would always be the best guy on the title winner.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:29 PM
Can we stop with the platitudes, Cursed? Prove Kobe’s better in some way, and I’ll shut up. He hasn’t been.
Kobe’s a great player, but if he is to be considered the best in the game today, we have to hold him to a little higher standard. He’s too inefficient, doesn’t distribute, and turns the ball over way too much to be the best.
He might have the talent to be the best, but I’m pretty sure he’ll never stop jacking up fadeaways and wasting possessions. The guy is 30. If he hasn’t figured it out by now, he’s not figuring it out.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:30 PM
You know I’m on the CP3
April 10th, 2008 at 1:30 PM
How about after the first round? Sorry Dirk
April 10th, 2008 at 1:32 PM
TBL- Jason Stewart was pushing for Kobe hard. Barkley said it should go to CP3. Jason Stewart was pretty relentless trying to push Kobe that it really killed the interview.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:33 PM
The CP3/Kobe argument is typical for sports news and talk radio. All arguments are easier and more “entertaining” if you narrow everthing down to yes/know, black/white, good/bad, aka two choices. And it’s such a big joke when you have something like this that could include at least 5 names (CP3, Kobe, Garnett, LBJ, and Howard). But hey, that’s good radio!
April 10th, 2008 at 1:33 PM
MLB announces their awards after the post-season (voting takes place before the play-offs). Not sure why that’s an issue elsewhere.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:33 PM
i hate the Celtics, but how come no KG MVP talk?
Chris Paul is good, but far from great. If you really want to know who the MVP is on the hornets, its Tyson chandler. why, because big men make the world go round
April 10th, 2008 at 1:34 PM
*fixed
April 10th, 2008 at 1:37 PM
hey now YYSA
April 10th, 2008 at 1:37 PM
haha sorry Irish couldn’t help it. off topic. Is your Magic going to trade JJ in the offseason?
April 10th, 2008 at 1:41 PM
Rumeal Robinson’s aunt was my 2nd grade teacher.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:42 PM
@YYSA- he came on last night in garbage time and made a three pointer. he is the NCAA record holder for most threes and most dicks up his @#$, but i think he has potential to be like Steve Kerr. A guy who is passed around from team to team, but to come in and knock down the three.
he wont get any playing time in the playoffs. He sits on the bench with his legs crossed like a little bitch and it drives me nuts. But he has potential
April 10th, 2008 at 1:44 PM
reddick should at least keep greedy cheerleaders and dancers off howard’s back if he isnt gonna contribute on the court.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:46 PM
lmao. that was good
April 10th, 2008 at 1:47 PM
Sorry TBL but one day you are complaining that people only talk about LeBron and Kobe, then you start one post saying that Kobe is the favourite by the papers then use LeBron James as a comparison (not CP3), then in the comments you said it’s CP3 that should win the award (like i’m saying in the last 2 months). To me it seems a lot of contradictions, “how about some variety on the Ballin’” then let’s start a post with Kobe then compare him to LeBron it’s the best way to get variety.
I assume that you will post another post about a “this is not a story”.
April 10th, 2008 at 1:47 PM
Yea with the Suns looking like there pick will be outside the lottery. I thought it would be intersting if they shipped the 15th pick for JJ. Afterall he was the 11th. I just could see Reddick being deadly in the Suns style. Well I guess it will be up to Steve Kerr whether or not he wants to trade for himself.
April 10th, 2008 at 2:03 PM
Redick was a waste of a pick at 11. We could of had Rajon Rondo, jordan Farmar, or even Labtop Marcus Williams. That would of settled of PG problem.
i hate Jameer Nelson with a passion
April 10th, 2008 at 2:07 PM
Jameer Nelson = reason Dwight eventualy leaves Orlando
just kidding
April 10th, 2008 at 2:08 PM
Nick, did you honestly just say Kobe doesn’t distribute. You love that little column in the box score titled “assists” don’t you. Here’s a clue as to what’s actually going on, sometimes a player passes and it eventually leads to an assist two passes later. Sometimes a player just passes to get the offense going. And in both those situations, your little column is unaffected, and you’re lead to believe that Kobe doesn’t pass the basketball.
Stats rule (in baseball).
April 10th, 2008 at 2:10 PM
And why are we all considering the Lakers to have this unbelievable roster of hall of famers when many people said the Lakers wouldn’t make the playoffs before the season started? The Cavaliers have some pretty darn good role players right now, yet they supposedly have the worst supporting cast in the history of basketball.
Seems like some people with agendas rate supporting casts after the fact.. hmmmm.
April 10th, 2008 at 2:15 PM
And maybe, just maybe, there’s a strong correlation between real assists and your fabled hockey assists, leading me to believe Chris Paul and Steve Nash have their fair share of both. Same with Lebron.
I guess what I’m saying is that I don’t think Kobe is unduly penalized for being the best hockey assister alive.
And obviously when I say he doesn’t distribute, I mean, distributing “at a level representative of someone claiming to be the ‘best’ player in the NBA.”
April 10th, 2008 at 2:24 PM
a.) the lakers made the playoffs the last two years.
b.) nobody picked the hornets to make the playoffs either.
c.) assuming that wild claim re: the lakers is accurate, who did they pick for the playoffs in the west? portland…highly doubtful. minnesota, seattle, memphis, sacramento…no way. clippers…not without brand. the lakers have been a playoff lock since october.
d.) nobody assumed the lakers would be this good because they didn’t know they would add gasol in february, they didn’t know bynum would be the most improved player in the league (before his injury), and they didn’t know vujacic would become a competent role player.
if you’re a lakers fan (no clue if you are or not), why are you tearing down the rest of the team so kobe can win a silly award?
April 10th, 2008 at 3:22 PM
Rumeal.. I’m not tearing them down. Their bench has played well, Odom has played out of his mind over the last month. What I don’t get is why Cavalier fans (I’m one of them, just a bit more rational than the others on here) act like every player they have is worthless.
Truth be told, while I don’t think all supporting casts are equal, benches in particular are really not that different throughout the league. Some are better some are worse, but considering benches change every year based on guys coming and going, it’s pretty clear situations matter more than the players you have. If guys mesh well, that makes everyone better, if they don’t, then they all look bad. Nobody before this year thought the Lakers had that great of a bench, but they’ve played well together.
Getting back to the Kobe not distributing myth. Nick P, did you think MJ was a good distributor (waiting for you to talk through the trap).
April 10th, 2008 at 3:23 PM
Nick P.. also wondering, did you think MJ was a good rebounder? (waiting again for you to talk through my brilliantly laid out trap).
April 10th, 2008 at 3:28 PM
Yeah I would. For sure. Also turned the ball over less than Kobe.
Plus considering Michael Jordan was an infinitely better scorer (again making the assumption a good scorer makes shots), he didn’t necessarily have to be a great distributor.
Better than Kobe as a distributor? Fo’Sho.
Check this out and tell me how you don’t agree that 1+1 = 2.
April 10th, 2008 at 3:47 PM
Nick, if you discount Kobe’s first two seasons (which he clearly wasn’t ready for NBA basketball).. Kobe averages more assists and slightly less rebounds.. So what exactly are you basing the “distributing myth” on that you’re attempting cite as fact?
MJ’s shooting percentage is commendable, and definitely better than Kobe’s..although impossible to compare eras. I could easily argue that MJ was a man amongst boys, with nobody in his athletic class, while if he were to play not, each and every team in the league has a guy at 6′7 that can move laterally with him, don’t you think that would hinder his shooting percentage a tad? I think it would.. Just my opinion though. And don’t bring up zones.. b/c zones haven’t hindered the elite players at all.
I’m with you that MJ is the GOAT.. just don’t say he’s a distributor and Kobe isn’t.. just patently untrue. And in Kobe’s career (even including his first two years), he’s averaging 2.9 turnovers.. MJ 2.7. Is that a chasm as well? Pretty similar if you ask me (or any other rational person without an agenda).
April 10th, 2008 at 3:58 PM
You can argue that, but it would be wrong.
I agree. Considering the absense of hand-checking in today’s game, MJ’s shooting percentage would likely be higher. He’d either get to the basket easier or have a ton more free throw attempts.
The funny thing about fractions is that when you make the numerator bigger (5.4 APG for MJ to 4.6) while concurrently making the denominator smaller (2.8 TOs for MJ to 2.9), the ratio as a whole gets considerably bigger. (1.94 to 1.57)
Might not seem like a lot, but it actually is. MJ’s A/TO ratio is 24% better, which is huge.
Only if you don’t care about rates, which you’ve proven time and again.
April 10th, 2008 at 4:25 PM
Nick, I’d rather play against lesser athletes and let them handcheck me all day than the opposite. But that’s just me.
And how would I be wrong. Look at the rosters in the 80’s and look at the athletes. There were maybe 6 guys in the whole league with the combination of athleticism and size of Stephen Jackson.. In today’s NBA, there are 50 Stephen Jacksons (with various levels of weaponry)
I think that’s a huge distinction, and you seem to be glancing over it. Good point about the handchecking, but I gotta tell you, I’ll let 6th graders handcheck me all day, I’ll kill those fools to the rim.. !!
Still not buying that MJ was a head over heels better ball distributor than Kobe, you’re not really proving that with your statistical analysis. You’re telling me Kobe turned it over more when doing so (you’re making a giant assumption that Kobe’s passes were stolen, when a turnover could be many things, like say, a charge – No dotted line in MJ’s era!!!)
April 10th, 2008 at 4:26 PM
And you should just call me and argue with me.. since everyone else has bowed out.. (as usual!)
April 10th, 2008 at 4:27 PM
been watching the masters cursed
April 10th, 2008 at 4:50 PM
I’ve been Mastering this argument!
April 10th, 2008 at 4:59 PM
Infinitely? Really? Isn’t that a rather large amount? “Better” wouldn’t suffice? I’d say MJ was an infinitely better scorer than, I don’t know, a career 8 ppg SG.
Nick, you make some good points sometimes, but they’re overshadowed by your outrageous and exaggerated claims such as this and calling Kobe winning the MVP a “travesty.” Not to mention your overbearing LeBron agenda. LeBron’s been out of the MVP race for a while now, so why do you still feel the need to berate Kobe all the time?
So you don’t think Kobe is the best player in the game; fine, a lot of people don’t. But many also think he is. Just like many think he deserves the MVP and is the “real” MVP. Seems like you feeling very strongly about this issue somehow invalidates every other fan and writer who think Kobe is the best/MVP.
April 10th, 2008 at 5:20 PM
Goose you’re just bitter because you’d rather have Kobe than Dirk, you and EVERYONE ELSE NOT NAMED NICK P!!!
April 10th, 2008 at 7:42 PM
Or everyone else who’s not blinded by 81, and can look beyond PPG averages?
But thanks for criticizing my use of “infinitely.” Far be it from me to ever use even a hint of hyperbole.
Although, Kobe’s PER (a metric that I find faulty considering it rewards volume shooters LIKE KOBE) of 23.6 is far below Jordan’s 29.1.
I.e. the difference between Kobe and Jordan is greater than the difference between Kobe and Corey Maggette. Food for thought. Maybe infinitely isn’t so far off?
/Wholeheartedly apologize for being the first person in the history of teh interwebs to make a poor adverb selection.
April 11th, 2008 at 12:48 AM
Nick, just scoring wise? (re: the Maggette example)
And PPG is a pretty good indicator of scoring ability. Maybe it’s just me. Not blinded only by the 81; also the 60s, 50s, 40s (12 in a row). Sounds like a damn good scorer.
If talking about purely scoring, this is a comparison with Jordan that actually has some merit. Kobe is pretty damn close (ignoring other facets of the game) and in some aspects better: 3 pt. shooting and finishing left handed.