The Always-Fun, Always-Subjective MVP Debate
Baseball October 8th. 2008, 1:15pm
Take it away, Intern Bill!
NL MVP: Albert Pujols, 1B St. Louis. He wins this one in a walk, and it’s not even close. The finest season of an already outstanding career, Pujols got on base a startling 46% of the time, second only to fellow MVP candidate Chipper Jones. Two neat facts to consider:
* Assuming Barry Bonds never made his chemically-aided assault on the record books, and the voters picked the right guy in 2006, Pujols would have four MVP awards right now. Four! Only Bonds ever had more than three. We might be seeing the greatest clean player of all time.
* Most similar batters through age 27 according to the invaluable baseball-reference.com: Joe DiMaggio, Jimmie Foxx, Frank Robinson, Ken Griffey Jr., Hank Aaron, and Mickey Mantle. Pretty nice company.
Better luck next year: Hanley Ramirez, Chipper Jones, Lance Berkman, Manny Ramirez.
AL MVP: Dustin Pedroia, 2B, Boston Red Sox. Statistically speaking, Alex Rodriguez and Grady Sizemore have both been more valuable players. But you can’t give a player whose team was out of it practically two months into the season capture an MVP award. As for A-Rod, he played terrific baseball on a very good team, and it’s not his fault his team was out of it at the end. If Rodriguez wasn’t injured at the beginning of the season, his numbers might have been even better. It would be in very poor taste to give the MVP award to a guy whose team missed the playoffs since the last labor strike.
Pedroia is the best player on one of baseball’s best teams. He’s short enough to be considered scrappy and rowdy enough to be considered a leader. Expect him to win the MVP.
Maybe next year: Josh Hamilton, Carlos Quentin, Joe Mauer.
69 Responses to “The Always-Fun, Always-Subjective MVP Debate”
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October 8th, 2008 at 1:16 pm
Ryan Howard not even getting a “BLNY” call out? Impressive. Are we sure this is Intern Bill?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Weird sentence.
Who says Pujols is clean?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
How is Chipper on the NL list but ARod isn’t on the AL list? That seems biased.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
Shouldn’t Manny be on the maybe next year list for AL MVP. Since he is going to sign with the yankees
October 8th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
It should be no contest, but somehow, some way, he’ll get screwed out of the award; you watch. It’s not in the nature of the BBWAA to do the logical thing.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
why not? grady didn’t have ortiz, manny for half the seasons, a great year from JD Drew, mike lowell, etc. protecting him in the lineup. a-rod was a better player on a worse team.
this rationale blows.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
Wow…Slow clap…you still are terrible and I hate your soul…but nice work
October 8th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
Evan Longoria should win the AL ROY
October 8th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
Remember in April and May when Chase Utley was the easy MVP choice? What happened to that?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
In other news, the sky is blue and the Pope is Catholic.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:23 pm
June, July, August and September
October 8th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
Remember Howard’s MVP year, when Pujols said he didnt think a player from a team not in the playoffs should win it? I think that should come back to bite him.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
irish don’t take this the wrong way, but that might win the obvious statement of the year award. Personally I think Mauer should be the AL MVP. Led the league in WARP, is the best defensive catcher out there, although this year wasn’t as good as last year, and handled a young pitching staff really well. Plus catcher is a much more important position than second base. But hey, one out of two isn’t bad, and Pedroia probably WILL win, but I don’t think he should.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
Giving Intern Bill the keys to a subjective debate is pretty ballsy.
I’m of the opinion that the Most Valuable Player is the player who performed the best. Whether you’re valuable to a 70 win team or a 95 win team wouldn’t sway my vote. So for me, it’s Grady and Albert.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:25 pm
lets face it…in the AL, there’s no deserving player. in fact, the guy with the best case for it won last year and everyone hates him.
the fact that DUSTIN FUCKING PEDROIA is going to win the MVP should sicken each and every one of you.
DOES THE MVP HAVE ANY VALUE ANYMORE?!?!?!?!
morneau a few years ago…now pedroia? ugh.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:25 pm
I’d like to see Alexi Ramirez steal a few votes, but I’m realistic. I’ll be happy with a clear-cut 2nd place vote for him.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:26 pm
And there’s the first salvo. Sure didn’t take long.
Truth is, how do we know anyone is clean?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:26 pm
Great question.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:27 pm
im just saying…
October 8th, 2008 at 1:27 pm
Right, but he still put up good numbers, and I think he was more valuable than Rollins and Howard this season.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:27 pm
That’s my point, Bruce.
Albert’s team would have made the playoffs in the NL West. Sucks that he wasn’t in a terrible division.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:29 pm
No player under 5′5″ deserves the MVP.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:30 pm
Rockets- He was, but in the world of the mainstream media you can suck for 5 months and have a big September and be in the MVP talk.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:31 pm
clearly K-Rod should be MVP.
/bizarro NickP
October 8th, 2008 at 1:32 pm
Pedroia? He isn’t the best, 2nd best, or 3rd best POSITION player on his own team. He sees all fastballs because no one wants to walk the midget before the better hitters come to the plate. He had a nice year. Good for him. He certainly doesn’t exude Valuable as part of his resume though.
Youkilis, despite my utter hatred for him, is easily the most valuable guy in their lineup this year. The Sawx kept up their great offensive numbers when Ortiz was out because he was having a career year.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:32 pm
You would have been better off making fun of his hair.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:34 pm
You’re overlooking defense and position scarcity. Truth is, Pedroia was the best player for them this year. But he wasn’t as good as Grady.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:35 pm
Ok, good, just wanted to make sure it wasn’t in my head.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
manny was better…OOPS!
October 8th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
The argument that your team has to be in the playoff hunt doesn’t fly with me. If your team is miles ahead in its division, taking away one player likely doesn’t make it a cellar-dweller. If your team is a perennial loser, one player can’t turn them into a contender. If your team wins the division by one game, then if your guy is so great, they should have been miles ahead.
The argument that a guy on a last-place team has less pressure on him to perform is bogus. If the Yankees were in last place, wouldn’t A-Rod or Jeter have just as much pressure (from New Yorkers) to perform as Longoria would in the baseball hotbed of Tampa?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:37 pm
Was Prdroia better than Ian Kinsler?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:37 pm
@h8r: No, Kinsler is one of the worst defenders in the league at 2B.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:39 pm
Mauer? (Anyone but Pedroia!)
October 8th, 2008 at 1:39 pm
Ian Kinsler died two months ago.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
h8r: yes
October 8th, 2008 at 1:44 pm
“Right, but he still put up good numbers, and I think he was more valuable than Rollins and Howard this season.”
Wow, really?
More valuable than Rollins, sure. But, it is pretty absurd to think Utley was more valuable than Howard. Howard’s hitting with runners in scoring position is what got the Phillies to the playoffs. Utley wasn’t nearly as good in that regard. I can maybe buy the Utley argument if you just glance at the stats. But, really, it just seems silly to me.
I’m not saying that Howard should be NL MVP. I admit as a Phillies fan that I am really fuckin’ biased. However, in terms of MVP for the Phils, it goes Howard, then Lidge and the gap depends on your value of closers compared to everyday players. I don’t think Utley should even be in the discussion.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:45 pm
2 words….
Derek Jeter
October 8th, 2008 at 1:47 pm
Say Pedroia’s not deserving all you want, but the stat line Kurkjian found where he compares to Gehrig or something ridiculous over a month is persuasive.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:48 pm
so is the award going to the most valuable player to his team this year or the best player in the league? There seems to be no consistency with this award.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:48 pm
2 more…
Gobbles cock.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:49 pm
you should be ashamed for listening to tim kurkjian.
so his performance over a month is worthy of an award that celebrates a season’s effort?
October 8th, 2008 at 1:52 pm
@spence: Yes, and it’s an even better reason to give a guy a huge contract.
/Steve Phillips
October 8th, 2008 at 1:53 pm
What’s the beef with Kurkjian? I like the guy, and not just because his 2 minute video package/statistical-bukkake cemented the idea that my boy Biggio will get into the HOF…
October 8th, 2008 at 1:55 pm
It’s spelled “cosistency”.
/Joe Morgan’d
October 8th, 2008 at 1:56 pm
that’s part of it…biggio a HoF’er? why not let everyone in then?
but seriously…kurkjian is the baseball version of mike and mike in the morning. he doesn’t give you baseball information, he gives you baseball bullshit. what exactly, does tim kurkjian do? why should we value his opinion? what is his opinion?
he’s a fucking crackbaby full of bullshit and i’d rather listen to steve phillips…
October 8th, 2008 at 1:56 pm
Jaboo, that’s what I was looking for. I didn’t follow the Phillies day to day or look closely at stats like BA w/RISP.
I actually heard a decent case made for Lidge as MVP of the Phillies. In 72 games, 0 Blown Saves, 2 Wins, sub 2 ERA, and the Phillies won 70 of his 72 appearances. Interesting.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
good idea. Ladies and Gentlemen, Don Mattingly.
October 8th, 2008 at 1:58 pm
2 words….
Derek Jeter
2 more…
Gobbles cock.
2 more…
Minka Kelly
2 more…
John Mayer
2 more…
Sloppy Seconds
October 8th, 2008 at 2:00 pm
Tampa Bo-Justin Timberlake has had all of Jeter’s sloppy seconds.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:00 pm
For real? I don’t know, Biggio did a lot of good things for a long time. He wasn’t great or anything, but he was real good for a real long time. Mattingly can’t say the same thing. It wouldn’t bother me all that much to have Biggio in the HOF.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
that’s part of it…biggio a HoF’er? why not let everyone in then?
As soon as everyone does this, then I’m game for them all getting in:
October 8th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Late to the party, but…
You just contradicted yourself in back-to-back sentences. Congratulations.
Simmons makes this argument (and I agree with him) about Michael Jordan and the NBA MVP. One player is so far above all the others that they take his performance for granted and give the award to other people.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
No, not for real. But that’s my boy.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
Biggio will be in the HOF compared to some of the people they’ve already elt in. If you want to argue that the Hall should be more selective, I agree with you but it’s not going to happen, so he should start reserving a hotel in Cooperstown.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Also, Biggio could probably whip Grady’s ass even today… and he’d still have enough left in the tank for Gimpy Wells too!
/how arguments should be settled
October 8th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Did I really just read through this thing and nobody brought up Manny for MVP??? Are you guys out of your mind??? It’s Most…VALUABLE…Player. The Dodgers were horrible without him.
John Lester is an easy pic for AL MVP. Red Sox wouldn’t be in the ALCS without him. He dominated the Angels. Lackey pitched awesome in those two games and lost both.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:13 pm
Derrek Lee should win the MVP
/stigs at MLJ… idiot
October 8th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
hey benji, who’s Oliver?
/stigs at MLJ
October 8th, 2008 at 2:18 pm
no idea man. you’ve gotta read that junk to know.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:18 pm
mamalickaboobooday, you’re supposed to add /sarcasm after something like that. Otherwise people get confused.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:23 pm
So….Geovanny Soto?
/ducks random flying objects at head
/kidding
October 8th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
Again with the craptastic stats that mean nothing to the average (and even above average) fans.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:27 pm
If pedroia wins the mvp it instantly becomes a meaningless award! You’ve gotta be kidding me. Personally I don’t think anyone on the Sox should win it, shoudl be Quentin or Morneau, but this article perfectly breaks down why Pedroia isn’t even the MVP on his own team.
Read this
October 8th, 2008 at 2:30 pm
Gimme the guy who leads in grit and dirty uniforms.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
Ichiro won an MVP didnt he? They both hit and have stellar defense. There would be nothing wrong with the award if Pedroia got it.
October 8th, 2008 at 2:46 pm
Gimme the guy who leads in grit and dirty uniforms.
Best comment ever left in an MVP post/thread.
October 8th, 2008 at 3:20 pm
@fattyslick… Those are exactly my sentiments. Most Valuable Player shouldn’t mean Best Stats award. Sometimes they are hand in hand, while other times there is more to the story.
If it’s best stats, give the award the ARod. He dominates statistically, even when he was out for a stretch.
If it’s best stats on a playoff team, then Youkilis kicks Pedroia around like he would in a playground fight. (And, as for defense, Goat Boy is a great 1B and played a solid 3B in Lowell’s absence.)
Mauer would be a good call at MVP in the way that he handled a young pitching staff as well as hitting the cover off the ball. The Twins had NO business being 1 game from the playoffs, yet there they were courtesy of Mauer, Morneau, Nathan, and 22 nobodies…
And in the NL, I would vote for Manny. His appearance in the Dodger lineup makes them the favorite to get to the World Series (and yes, I said that before they “upset” the Cubs too).
October 8th, 2008 at 4:39 pm
If you’re going to talk about defensive value, you have to remember that Youkilis was versitile enough to fill in at 3B for about 35 games while Lowell was out, playing excellent defense both there and at 1B. That was huge. Since he also had better offensive sthats than Pedroia (better OBP, a MUCH better SLG, and 12 more homers – in about 120 fewer ABs), I think Youk is clearly a better MVP candidate than Pedroia
October 8th, 2008 at 9:15 pm
I promise I did not write this under the pseudonym “Intern Bill”.