Some Silly Media Reaction to the US Soccer Team
Media Gossip/Musings, Soccer July 2nd. 2009, 12:00pm
The United States’ unexpectedly successful run in the Confederation Cup aroused the attention of the mainstream media. This gave a few soccerphobes the forum to cloak their neuroses beneath alleged truisms about “American†reaction to the sport. Not only are these “common sense†statements trite and cliched, but they are misguided and often irrelevant. Here are three particularly irksome ones.
Soccer’s goal is to be as popular as other mainstream American sports. It will never be.
Soccer “will never touch baseball, touch basketball, touch football in America. It’s just not going to happen,†Kornheiser said on PTI.
Kornheiser is correct. MLS and European leagues probably will not overtake the popularity of those sports. However, no one is arguing that. It’s not realistic at this point, nor is it necessarily desirable. Don Garber already said MLS is not trying to convert Americans to soccer, but convert soccer fans to MLS. Do you get equally as uppity about the sky being blue or Thai food being spicy?
There are enough soccer fans in the U.S. to sustain a professional league. There are enough to foster two soccer specific networks showing every major European match. There is enough interest for ESPN to televise international matches. Josh Elliott gets snippy when soccer highlights are shortchanged. I’m satiated.
If soccer is making no inroads, why is it being discussed on PTI?
Soccer fans irrationally demand more media coverage.
“There’s nobody to blame, particularly all my brothers and sisters from the media who get smacked around by the Soccer Nazis because we don’t care. The soccer nuts remain a minority, but they love to scream a lot about the injustices of our failure to devote more time and energy to soccer news,” George Diaz wrote.
George Diaz and others with no interest, we don’t want you to write about soccer. We can get our news elsewhere. The Internet is a wonderful thing. We merely ask that if you choose to write or talk about the sport, you show the same level of professionalism.
Don’t flippantly reference “pubs that air games in the middle of the night.€Â Have the time or the intelligence to realize that Europe is six hours ahead and South America is in the same time zone, so soccer matches generally happen in the morning or early afternoon, not at night.
Also, if newspapers had perfect knowledge of what the American public wanted, the medium would not be dying. Maybe you should explore other avenues to attract people instead of whining and being condescending toward your potential audience.
Soccer fans are evangelists who want to destroy the American way of life.
Diaz mentions “Soccer Nazis.€Â I believe the historical term he was grasping for was “zealot.€Â Soccer fans, even the most ardent, are not rounding up those who disagree with them and placing them in gas chambers.
This has nothing to do with soccer. You stereotype soccer fans as “Un-American†because they won’t let you say “effeminate†or “gay†in a public forum. Soccer fans are stereotyped as wealthy, white, college-educated and liberal. Like most stereotypes, it is bred out of fear and misunderstanding.
The best thing about American culture is that there isn’t one. People brought their culture with them from all over the world. Regions developed their own distinct identities, dialects and cuisines. There is room for everyone.
Soccer is not a lifestyle-defining choice. It’s following another sport. Like a spectacular wine or a scintillating novel, we may recommend it to you. We will defend it if you disparage it ignorantly. But, we are not an insidious fifth column trying to convert you to anything.
123 Responses to “Some Silly Media Reaction to the US Soccer Team”
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July 2nd, 2009 at 12:07 PM
I thought this was funny.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:07 PM
This is what people don’t understand. I don’t want some douchebag who doesn’t know a damn thing about the sport to be apart of it (I’m looking at you Dave O’Brien). I could care less if soccer explodes in the U.S. because I know it isn’t going anywhere overseas and that is what I watch any way. I have not watched a full MLS game in the entire history of the league, and I am their target demographic. So when some dude named George Diaz says anything about soccer, I could care less. Dude is just like most sports writers who go for the easy “soccer is gay” articles.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:08 PM
“cloak their neuroses”… “particularly irksome”
Serious question Ty, do you know how to write clauses that aren’t so obviously cumbersome? Did you not take English 101 or Journalism 101? These phrases are just clumsy, and they detract from your themes. I wish I had a red pen.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:10 PM
Duffy…just bringing the thunder as of late. Keep them coming man.
Because it’s aired on ESPN. Reali, too.
AND
BURN. And exactly right.
Shit…I’m a soccer fan!?? Wait…wealthy. Nevermind.
AMURRRRICA!!
/TyDuffy of comments’d
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:10 PM
Shit, I like soccer and I fit three of those categories. I’m a flippin’ stereotype.
Wait, are we talking about soccer or hockey?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:12 PM
CC – You just proved his point. But not about soccer…about writing. C’mon man, take it for what it’s worth. Don’t just read it to pick at it.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:12 PM
Now that I plodded through the rest of the odd sentence construction, I think you’re right about the misunderstanding, but not about the fear. I’ve never heard from anyone who’s afraid of soccer. They may not get some of the rules or the lack of perceived “set offensive plays,” but they don’t fear it.
They may fear MMA b/c they don’t like the brutality, but in soccer, where would the fear derive from?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:13 PM
a bear falling out of tree is on PTI 3-4 times year, just like soccer. comedy is comedy.
wow, this couldn’t be more wrong. we are one of a few countries that are crazy about being on time. our censorship is absolutely crazy.(not comparing ourselves to places like the mid-east), just to name a couple of cultural differences.
this is why you have foreigners always saying “why do Americans always…”
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:13 PM
/Fixed for accuracy
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:14 PM
I just proved a point he didn’t make. You’ll have to explain that one to me.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:15 PM
A lot of Mex1cans play soccer, so the fear might come from that.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:17 PM
Point being that people who write about soccer just to criticize those who follow it shouldn’t be writing about soccer. I’m not what you’d call a soccer fan, but I don’t write about it just to throw it under the bus.
That was the point.
Your first comment (not your second, which is valid) is just picking at Duffy’s writing style just for the sake of picking at it. What’s the point? He’s not writing it just for you.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:17 PM
Duffy does like to rock out the big clauses that can get in the way, but sometimes he pulls them off brilliantly.
Oh yeah, Chris McKendry can eat a fat one for that bs radio extra point.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:18 PM
Vinnie Jones?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:18 PM
That had to be a joke, right? Please tell me he was mocking the stereotype.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:20 PM
she could eat my fat one for free.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:21 PM
SouvenirCity,
I think Ty has some interesting reads sometimes. I just think his sentence structure comes off like a college journalist trying too hard to use big words and phrases so that it earns him credibility (i know from experience) – which detracts.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:21 PM
All bloggers are soccer fans then.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:22 PM
Great post Duffy except for yet another boneheaded line like this one:
Any European for starters begs to differ. Didn’t you ever see any LOUD fellow Americans, usually fat and dressed sloppily as if right out of Wal-Mart, when you were just over there? I always hide from them for sure.
For more education about American culture, in pride or in shame, please view again this video. For extra credit, guess the root source song from which its guitar riff is derived.
ADS NOT SAFE FOR WORK AT ALL DO NOT CLICK UNLESS SAFE
Use discretion for video’s language and some images too, as they are probably not safe for work either but not like the ads.
http://www.funfreepages.com/flash/america_fuck_yeah.php
(the previous clip on YouTube with SuperAndy’s cameo and the Clown impostor on guitar was removed by YouTube due to some copyright violation)
It sure is not your uppity Manhattan-type Metro New York “culture” Duffy, but the video is pretty accurate on mainstream American culture.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:23 PM
CC – Understandable. And..
Me too.
/extends hand, buys drink
//doesn’t care that it’s 11:23 my time
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:24 PM
Soccer fans are stereotyped as being guys named Zack, wears a backpacks, eats granola and plays hacky-sack
/Cowherd the other day’d
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:25 PM
my problem with the a lot of soccer fans is that they take this approach of “we don’t care if it doesn’t get big.” Bullshit. You would love it to get bigger, so that you could enjoy more coverage of it. That’s is horsehit. That is why i call them the punk rock fans of the sports world.
at least hockey fans admit that they clamor for more coverage of the sport they love.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:26 PM
cant get to the video, but that first paragraph is a stereotype, not a culture.
there’s no ONE american culture…life in california is vastly different from life in texas or florida or new york.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:26 PM
I just think his sentence structure comes off like a college journalist trying too hard to use big words and phrases so that it earns him credibility (i know from experience) – which detracts.
He’s just emulating what he hears and reads from the European press. That’s how they talk and write. Ty will find his voice. I think it was a valid criticism on Cleveland’s part. He was up front and not an ass about it.
However…
The best thing about American culture is that there isn’t one.
I don’t understand that at all.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:27 PM
Clown is correct and I was going to make the same point. Much of the criticism of soccer is borne ultimately out of xenophobia.
Note however such phobia is legitimate if from illegal immigrants as opposed to legal immigrants, which is an important distinction almost always overlooked in mainstream US media reporting that never confronts truthfully the immigration matter.
Clown’s state of Texas, like my former state of Nevada, California, New York, and Arizona have especially a massive problem in such regard, so “all things immigrant” including soccer often get the rub as in fact California now is bankrupt over illegal immigration at the core.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:28 PM
Good points Duffy.
/hate soccer
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:28 PM
I think Ty is giving these guys too much credit. There are a few to whom soccer has become a true emblem of American exceptionalism, but most of them don’t really belive deeply in their arguments. They just like having something to be cranky about and no amount of rational arguments will prevent that.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:29 PM
True Spencer, but YOU go to Europe first and I promise you that you WILL spot the American not in your group almost no matter where they are from. A whole continent of Europeans sure can with high accuracy, and that is no accident or a judgement but just tourist reality.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:29 PM
yeah caught that jpq. pretty funny. names are zach, nick, or ethan and go backpacking through europe in the summer.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:30 PM
paolo…if i go to europe, chances are i’ll be in amsterdam and be too baked to notice anything.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:30 PM
I think this merely extends to the fact that we’re the melting pot of the world. Like Spencer said, life in CA is different from IL, FL, NY etc etc. There isn’t one single culture that we all adopt.
Fuck yes, Sparty.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:31 PM
Except that I really don’t give a shit. Our best athletes are never going to play soccer, so I do not care if the MLS takes off. The game is best watched when it is played at the highest level (duh) and that is in Europe. Seeing as how I can watch those games on TV every week, why the fuck should I care if it gets more coverage from the likes of ESPN?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:31 PM
This is true …for the 1980s in affluent American suburbs …in high school we called them “soccer fags” …what a douche that Cowturd. Cowturd if you are reading GO FUCK YOURSELF AGAIN!
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:33 PM
Not my fault the airplane lost my luggage and all I had was the stars and stripes windsuit that I went with.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:33 PM
Best city I have ever been to if you are only there for 3 days. Good god I would go there right now if I could. Just thinking about that city makes me smile ear-to-ear.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:34 PM
some would argue that they are our best athletes.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:35 PM
One reason that I don’t really go out of my way to view soccer (except World Cup Games)… is that I cannot have a full appreciation of these players and their ridiculous talent. I didn’t play soccer growing up. But when I see a player, I can only differentiate his skill set based on when he has the ball, b/c when they don’t have the ball, they’re just running up and down the field. In basketball, I can see their movements a little better and how they defend and rebound.
In football, you see guys running backs catching the ball and blocking, you see quarterbacks audibling and scrambling, you see defensive players blitzing and dropping into coverage.
As the naive soccer observer, I only see players with the ball, or if they’re without it, running. And not playing the sport, I don’t get to appreciate all their talents.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:35 PM
+$1.05
/because that’s what freedom costs
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:35 PM
Punk rock *did* get big.
All it did for us old farts was make us more cranky and hateful. The Vandals played fucking Red Rocks a few weeks ago. How dare they make money? Get back to the dive bars where we can throw stuff at you.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:36 PM
You could use that same statement to argue that Anna Kournikova and Michele Wie are relevant.
/Kornheiser’d
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:37 PM
yeah caught that jpq. pretty funny. names are zach, nick, or ethan and go backpacking through europe in the summer.
duder: I turned the ignition on just as he started saying that. I’m surprised “Colin” wasn’t named. That’s right up there in his stereotype
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:38 PM
If AI and LeBron had played soccer, we would be defending World Cup champions.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:39 PM
no, it didn’t. a few bands did well.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:39 PM
LOL Spencer …I don’t blame you …well in case you are not baked and going to a DIFFERENT city.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:40 PM
that’s what i got out of his statement too.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:42 PM
Brock Lesner would not help our cause.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:42 PM
No one in their right mind would argue that the starting left back for (insert MLS teams here) is a better athlete than Kobe or LeBron.
Great point. If you have never played the game at a fairly high level, it is impossible to understand how hard it is to do the things that they do. People also don’t realize how hard it is to score a goal in soccer, but they don’t care to look at it that way because that would require actual thinking, at that is too hard to do (apparently).
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:43 PM
Same, hadnt listened to him in a few months. Will start listening once college football starts.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:43 PM
Nope. Prevailing at that level takes more than individual talent, size, and/or speed. Like basketball and football the best TEAMS win.
And please if you are going to make this argument pick guys with championship trophies, unless of course you were just trying to stoke the fires that burneth within us here as usual Clown.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:44 PM
With Garnett, or another freaky athletic 7 footer in goal.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:47 PM
LeBron isnt coordinated enough to play soccer. Or baseball. Did you ever see him try to hit a softball? Think Chris Rock in celebrity softball.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:47 PM
Cursed:
How is “obviously cumbersome” all that different from “particularly irksome”?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:48 PM
So if someone never played basketball after 8th grade, that means they can’t understand the difficulties of what NBA players do?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:48 PM
Culturally, image-wise, it did. We’re not talking record sales, here, although when it “got big” (aka early ’90s) there were plenty. Fuck, the Meat Puppets even got in on the trough for a while.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:49 PM
Please. If we had our best athletes playing soccer, we’d be wrecking shop. You think Michael Vick or Adrian Peterson would’ve fallen over from a Zidane headbutt like that faggy Italian?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:50 PM
LeBron isnt coordinated enough to play soccer. Or baseball. Did you ever see him try to hit a softball? Think Chris Rock in celebrity softball.
I bet Landon Donovan can’t hit a shot from the seats behind the basket
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:50 PM
for some reason the comments don’t seem to be working in this thread. anyway, i’ll try again.
i always thought duffy to be obnoxious if not arrogant but never dumb. the statement in italics seriously is testing my latter premise.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:52 PM
You cannot compare the two. I’m sorry that people just don’t understand it, but it is what it is when it comes to soccer. This is the reason why I stopped trying to bring people to soccer. It is the one sport more than almost all others (baseball is another one) that if you did not play the game at a high level you simply have no idea how to judge the little things. It is why Euros by and large don’t like baseball. They don’t understand the intricacies of the game.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:52 PM
Souvenir, I don’t agree with your comment about American culture. It DOES exist. I do not agree with the melting pot propaganda as far as its totality after having lived in 5 cities and visited 4 regularly. See my post and the copied video above.
I see instead a country with a great spirit and fine heart though with multiple elements of dissent and differences either marginalised by an oppressive state or swept conveniently and arrogantly into the closet as if they don’t really exist.
We have come a long way, but based on what I have seen here in PA in what looks to me like 1980s Georgia on the East Coast and socially backass including more racism than anywhere I have been except Georgia outside of Atlanta, we have so far to go.
Someone out to take a big dump in that “melting pot” for good and put it to rest. That’s what it is good for when you peel away the layers of the reality of life across America.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:55 PM
its a matter of math. We have 4 major sports leagues in this country while the rest of the world plays soccer and not much else. Theres no room in this country for soccer.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:55 PM
You’ve gotta be kidding me. Baseball? Are you really Clint Hurdle?
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:56 PM
+1
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:58 PM
If you have never tried to hit a 90 mph fast ball or a nasty curve you would not get how hard it is by watching it on tv. The same goes for soccer and all of the things that you must do to succeed playing it. I know people would rather pigeon-hole an argument into simple black and white points, but it isn’t that simple.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:58 PM
not sure that’s accurate but it’s a very interesting point.
July 2nd, 2009 at 12:59 PM
and white people can’t hear jimmy.
don’t bring baseball into the discussion. baseball gets knocked because it is a slow game to watch on TV. it is, especially if you get a game that had beckett matched up with mussina. there are people that played it at a high level that can’t stand watching it.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:00 PM
in short, that’s a reach.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:00 PM
Because the best ATHLETES are always the champions in ANY sport right? Dream on Clown. Check the teams with the trophies, and I think you will find this more often than not to be the case.
There are plenty of supreme athletes and even Hall of Famers without trophies in many a team sport.
ATHLETES don’t make champions in and of themselves.
TEAMS with SOLID COACHING become champions.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:01 PM
i have never heard someone judge hitting a baseball by what they see on tv.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:02 PM
thank you.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:02 PM
I never played soccer, not once. It’s why I’m not a fan. Played just about every other sport at least once in my life on a competitive level.
I won’t disagree with what you said about certain parts of the country. But do you really think that there is one over-arching theme here? Capitalism and possessions? Narcissism? An air of superiority?
The AMURRRICA video does sum us up pretty well. But there’s an awful lot of ideologies, mannerisms and such covered in that video.
There’s a lot of bass-ackwards destinations in this country. I think the places that sums us up the best is….Vegas?
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:05 PM
I’m not trying to pigeonhole anything; I’m simply taking issue with your contention that the casual observer can’t understand baseball unless he/she has faced a 90 mph fastball. Because that’s silly.
That particular argument can be used on any sport, i.e. you don’t understand football until you’ve had a 240 lb. linebacker clean your clock. It’s simply not true.
I’d have given you soccer, at least in the context of Americans who didn’t grow up watching/playing it. But baseball is about the most intuitive game in existence. You don’t need to have faced Randy Johnson to understand it.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:05 PM
You sound like Gwyneth Paltrow.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:06 PM
Now that I can agree with…
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:08 PM
Please elaborate (seriously, I’m not being a dick, but I want your opinion).
I’m talking about understanding, not liking.
I’m confused? I was saying that if you were new to baseball and had not played it (as most Euros are), and you saw a game you would not know how hard it is to hit the ball. The same thing goes for soccer. Playing it when you were 8 doesn’t count.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:08 PM
I expect nothing less Mike (you’ve been a ghost lately, too).
But at least compare me to someone that didn’t name their kid Apple. Fuck, even Elisabeth Hasselbeck would be better than that.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:09 PM
but a lot of americans grow up playing it. myself, our TE, our Flanker, our center, our QB and our 2 RBs on my high school team all grew up playing youth soccer together, indoor and outdoor. most of us played in middle school, too. we got to high school and wanted to play football instead. that happens…a lot.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:10 PM
So you think if someone has never played baseball they can turn on a game and realize how hard it is to hit the ball?
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:10 PM
Kobe should get two rings for this past year. Doing double duty like that while associate head coach Phil Jackson sat in his chair is something to admire.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:10 PM
they understand it. don’t try to make it out to be cricket.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:12 PM
Which are all distinctively or uniquely American, for better and for worse, the way I see it.
Vegas is the “American fantasy.” That’s why people want to go there. And that’s why after many go a few times, the glitter begins to fade away. Or when you live there after about two months for that matter.
But Vegas is not really America though for sure a signficant contribution to American culture.
Meanwhile, the state of Nevada, populated mostly by folks in Las Vegas who call almost all the shots for the entire massive state, leads the nation in foreclosures with very high unemployment, crime, and the second-highest increase in the rate of usage of food stamps 1Q2008 to 1Q2009.
http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparetable.jsp?ind=649&cat=1
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:12 PM
no, you said playing at a high level.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:12 PM
i’m not being a dick either so please don’t misinterpret.
com’on. how many people do you know that played even in the lower minors? pick any MLB stadium and i’m confident there isn’t five percent of the crowd that even played short season minor leagues. yet i’m even more confident, i dunno, 80 percent of the same crowd, knows it takes a special breed of cat to hit MLB pitching.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:15 PM
that was your initial statement.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:16 PM
My in-laws have a timeshare in Orlando (one giant strip mall, fucking hate the place) so I’m forced to go down there once a year. We have no problems spotting the Euros that flood the place. Sunburned folks in soccer jerseys with boorish kids – British. Queer looking guy with oversized sunglasses and wearing clam diggers – French or Spanish, depending on skin tone. Every country has their own little idiosyncracies in culture, whether it’s manner of dress or amount of cologne that they bathe in.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:17 PM
that is because we are Americans and grew up with the sport. Euros didn’t. It is why they love soccer and we don’t.
I was referring to soccer only when I said high level. I was just using baseball as an example of a sport that Euros don’t toally understand (the intricacies that is).
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:17 PM
I’ve never been a ninja, but I see that Ninja Games show and figure yeah, that shit looks pretty hardcore. I’m guessing most people figure out that hitting a small white sphere traveling at high speeds isn’t all beer and skittles.
My point, and I imagine Sparty’s to an extent, is with your “high level” comment. No, I don’t think that you need to have played baseball at a high level to know that it’s a difficult game.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:18 PM
+1 Gods
Like baseball, you really have to be a player to appreciate its play at the highest level, which is why I like soccer but just don’t get into baseball hardly.
A personal preference like we all have has nothing to do with all the ranting that Duffy cites rightly for what it is in this overall fine post.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:18 PM
@Paolo – Good talk. As always.
And I agree with you on Vegas after a few trips. Been there 3 times and it’s already fading. But I’ll go back for football this year.
You think all of those poor stats for the state have something to do with there not being any native Nevedans? (is that right?) Most of the people that live there are transplants. Much like DC (also high homeless rate, unemployment etc.).
This is a sorta a tangent, but I said yesterday the reason why the Nats are a failure is because no one has an allegiance to them. The Skins, Wiz and Caps at least have a history so people can identify. If Vegas gets a team, no one will go to the games regularly.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:19 PM
This is disturbing.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:21 PM
“Baseball is another one” was your parenthetical aside, thus, the reference would be to both sports, yes?
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:22 PM
I should have stated that baseball is a sport that if you have not tried to hit a big league pitcher, you can’t fully appreciate how hard that is. As for soccer, if you have not played at a high level, you can’t FULLY understand how hard it is what they do.
As someone who has a lot of family from Europe, I can tell you with 100% certainty that people who have never played/watched Baseball have no clue how hard it is to get a hit. Yes, they understand the game in its basic sense, but they think hitting the ball should be the easy part when you watch the game for the first time.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:24 PM
I got lazy and should have said baseball is a sport that similarly fits the mold of soccer, but not to the same extent.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:24 PM
ok gods, i see what you are saying now.
(btw, duffy does his best to get me to hate soccer with his [sadly] typically arrogant, “we in the northeast like soccer because we are left wing and smarter than the rubes who live in flyover country).” he fits all the sterotypes of “soccerguy.” but outside of the nba and the nhl, soccer players are fantastic athletes. i just don’t give a damn about the sport. leave me be. thank you. i appreciate the athletism, just don’t care about it. same with the nba.)
dirty sanchez:
i was once in some beach community bar (i know, hard to believe) watching some game and this british family/group comes in. of course, one of the brits was just ripping us colonists because we absolutely couldn’t have a bar without a tv showing some game. what a bunch of drips!
meanwhile, he was wearing a cubs jersey. i’m confident he couldn’t name one cubs player.
when i read duffy’s homilies, it reminds me of this brit.
dirty sanchez:
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:25 PM
Fair enough.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:26 PM
Due to this convo I am terribly swamped at work and have to make a tee time…I’m off gents. Great discussion and have a great holiday.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:26 PM
have a good fourth gods.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:27 PM
you aren’t comparing apples to apples. and i have yet to have any that played at “high level” explain the intricacies. i asked it several times the other day on my site to those fans and people who played to explain the strategy of the game, not one person answered the question.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:30 PM
I had the experience of explaining American football to some Italian dudes once, and after I described one objective to gain 10 yards within four attempts or turn the ball over on downs, the immediate reaction even with all those large players on defense is that would seem rather easy.
If you have not grown up around a sport, and in some cases played it to a great degree, I can’t agree more with previous commenters that it is hard to understand or appreciate the performances at a high level that they make look so easy.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:30 PM
and i have yet to have any that played at “high level†explain the intricacies.
sparty – it’s complicated. You have to kick it with your feet. And at the highest levels, there are no orange slices at halftime, because their moms pick them up later.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:33 PM
The whole “soccer fan” stereotype is pretty odd. I’m a flyover country dummy and I like the game, and I’m definitely not alone in that.
I don’t pretend to any great understanding of it, nor have I adopted some overseas squad as my own (I used to work in a bar with a bunch of Irish dudes, so I guess I’d root for Celtic if I had to pick), but still. Not every soccer fan lives in Massachusetts and attends Andover.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:34 PM
but that is not what was originally said. he said you had to play at a high level to understand. that simply isn’t true. i played 8th grade soccer, i know what they do is difficult. i still don’t give a shit.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:36 PM
it’s simple to understand, honestly. Because it’s so hard to get it in the goal, and the goalie can use his hands, scoring chances are very important. From there, you learn what constitutes a scoring chance, and then bingo, you start looking for crosses, and set plays for close, and you see why they track corner kicks.
Then, you start looking for what happens on scoring chances, and you start to see the game.
Soccer is not an erudite sport. It’s quite simple. The skills at the top level are amazing, but the concepts are very simple and geometric.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:38 PM
you must have played at a high level.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:39 PM
Sparty, sometimes when Duffy posts about games, a few of us do discuss tactics and strategies involving formations. In fact, look up Duffy’s last post on the US team before TBL shared that great tale about the fall of the LA Galaxy.
However, if you genuinely have resigned yourself to not caring about soccer, will you even bother?
If not, don’t complain about folks like me who could give a shit about baseball even though we played Little League or other folks who could give a shit about soccer even though they might have played for bit as little kids.
I play rugby as well, but I certainly don’t get on the case of anyone who does not understand it as is the case for most folks whether European or American for sake of simplicity for this discussion. And if they don’t like it and don’t care to learn anything about it, so what? But if they want to put it down without understanding it (i.e. all the often negative stereotypes), well that is a whole different matter!
You can’t have it both ways Sparty. Either just state you are not interested or do some real research with quite a few people on here willing to share when the occasion arises often with one of Duffy’s posts about teams, leagues, or games.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:41 PM
you must have played at a high level.
I was the fattest kid on my under 9 team. But I got to play because my dad was the coach.
I actually played from ages 5-12, but I’m from the near the US/Mejico border, so everybody played.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:44 PM
Soccer is not an erudite sport. It’s quite simple. The skills at the top level are amazing, but the concepts are very simple and geometric.
you must be trying to impress tyduffy
/wordsmith’d
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:46 PM
of course not, thank you. but the (sterotypical) soccerguy would have you believe the sport is akin to latin. that only a mudeater wouldn’t like the sport because — all together now — “he doesn’t understand.”
maybe it’s just me, but i know of no other sport’s fans — not baseball, not hockey not even nascar — who use this card as a kneejerk reaction to people who don’t care for the sport. “you just don’t understand.”
it’s that elitist mentality that chases so many people away.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:47 PM
no no. you missed my original point. i don’t normally comment on the game itself, at this point it progressed to that. it is the attitude of a lot, not all, but a lot of fans that bother me. the ones that take the stance of “you just don’t get it. and we don’t care if it isn’t more popular.” I just don’t buy that. that is what i take issue with.
i don’t normally read the soccer posts that are about the games. just like a lot of people don’t read the hockey posts that are about hockey games. but that is not what this topic was about.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:48 PM
Soccer is a joke. Bunch of pansies. Simple as that. I find it laughable that folks really think it will catch on.
Rugby has a better chance than soccer.
When the best player in the countey is 5′9″ 165 it is over. So tired of the soccer conversation.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:51 PM
Rugby has a better chance than soccer.
You wish, and I wish. But no. Neither has a chance, because of the continuing action. There’s nowhere to put commercials.
I’d like to see the US Rugby Union scout NFL training camps, and hire on guys who get cut, and train them. Obviously, somebody would have to put a ton of money into it, but that’s where to get your guys. Not some 48 year old guy who loves Rugby as your captain. It’s no wonder we suck.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:52 PM
and what dirtheavy and jimmy just said pretty much summed it up. i was asking about strategy the other day is because i wanted to understand how it was soooo much different than a sport like hockey. obviously the boards vs out of bounds is different, and size other playing surface. but the point of the game is very similar.
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:54 PM
Agree with you about the elitism, but if you are not interested in soccer just say that and leave it at as well that why don’t you?
Otherwise how is it not rather elitist on YOUR part to rant against the game further because you DON’T want to make some bonafide effort to understand it beyond your post on your website to solicit commentary.
It’s another classic shit or get off the pot situation for you Sparty.
If you are interested, check out our posts another time or see Duffy’s last post about play at the high level. Also there were the many posts on Brazil USA. And of course it does take work to sort through the commentary for the more descriptive comments about formations and strategy. But nothing worth keeping is free right?
Otherwise, off the pot! (no pun intended for any stoners)
July 2nd, 2009 at 1:57 PM
I agree with Dirt but for different reasons. Like hockey, it is an awful sport for the television screen. Also rugby is much harder to understand.
Some rules changes are in serious discussion and trial to speed up the game as well as make it more exciting for players like myself.
Playing is a blast. Watching can be dreadfully dull even if you are a player.
But then so can American football in a game with too many penalties and all running plays for ball control football and all.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:01 PM
and if you read my post, i didn’t rant against the game. but turned into a discussion in the comments and i asked a question.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:01 PM
i can kind of relate this to golf…not everyone is going to be able to fully appreciate the intracacies of a hard draw to a back, right pin placement, but at the same time, anyone, even the link-novice’d among us can appreciate tiger vs. someone going head to head on the back 9 trading blows the whole way.
im getting into soccer slowly, but there are a lot of soccer matches that just don’t have this visceral appeal. if you have to understand all the subtleties of something, chances are good that something is missing the bigger picture.
whether it’s cultural or not isn’t relevant. sure a sloppy football game isn’t as good as a well played one, but at least there’s violence and action to take our minds off the flags and botched plays. soccer just doesn’t have that on a consistent level compared to the sports that americans enjoy.
if i imissed the point entirely, i apologize.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:02 PM
@denver, 5′9 165 sounds an awful lot like Allen Iverson, dustin pedroia (hate him but he IS an MVP) ladanian tomlinson, etc etc. Brinigng size into the equation is horrible. Is davied diehl a better athlete than Landon Donovan? no. And also, take a look at Jozy if you’d like size. 6′1, 6′2 and built like a truck.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:32 PM
You’d want to cut it in there, as opposed to draw, no?
/being a dick
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:37 PM
not everyone is going to be able to fully appreciate the intracacies of a hard draw to a back, right pin placement
Right. Learning about golf doesn’t start with how to spin a 60 degree lob wedge out of a buried lie on a rainy day.
Golf starts like this — little ball, big field, little hole. Ball in hole. And voila, you understand golf.
Of course golfers are douchebags who won’t even let casual players who have only ever played twice before(and got their clubs at a pawn shop) kick their ball off of the cart path, so they can learn how to hit a ball off the grass before they have to break their 3 iron on a patch of concrete. Fuckers.
Anyway, back to soccer. Can’t use your hands – get the ball into the net. That’s it, that’s soccer. And if you want to scream touchdown instead of goal, feel free.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:42 PM
You get a free drop from the cart path. Read the rulebook, shankapotamus.
/etrade’d
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:46 PM
yea, but that’s easy to appreciate…drawing it in there is way harder.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:52 PM
Hahahaha. That got me.
July 2nd, 2009 at 2:54 PM
A soccer post two days prior to our nation’s birthday? How utterly and unequivocably gauche!
July 2nd, 2009 at 3:02 PM
Proper spelling is a joke. Spelling things correctly is for pansies. I hope it never catches on, just like soccer. So tired of having to use spell check.